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miner2049er
22-02-11, 12:56
Here is our February Show (http://www.retrogamingroundup.com/shownotes/2011/roundup028_2011.02.htm) which marks our second anniversary, as UKDerek kindly notes in the wrap up.

This month we road tested the Live News Recording Segment with listeners in the ustream (http://www.ustream.tv) chat window.

Grab yourself a ustream (http://www.ustream.tv/) account for the next time we do this, and you can chat with us while we record the News and Listener Views for March.

Hardware Flashback - (00:00)
Guinness Gaming Records - (50:04)
Atar-Rewind - (52:08)
Midwest Gaming Classic - (63:24)
Top Ten Nintendo 64 Games - (83:31)
Pacman Power Pill - (234:46)
The British Hour - (238:13)
Jon St John Interview - (240:05)
Gaming Trivia - (266:26)
News And Listener Views - (267:23)
URLs And EMails - (346:55)

As always, See the shownotes (http://www.retrogamingroundup.com/shownotes/2011/roundup028_2011.02.htm) page. Donate (http://www.retrogamingroundup.com/donate.htm) to the show.
Join our Facebook Group (http://www.facebook.com/RetroGamingRoundup). Listen to the February Outtakes (http://www.retrogamingroundup.com/roundups/2011/RoundUp028_Outtakes.mp3).

indieseoul
22-02-11, 03:37
Singing: "Happy happy happy Anniversary" Congratulations on two years of extremely f%ing long podcasts. Wow you guys must be winded. It was fun chatting with ya this month on the URL stream. Sadly I will be hiking through the jungle next month, literally. No internet access so I hope you get more users to jump on the ustream. Come on guys get on the Ustream I mean how often do you get to see Socal in drag?

Cynicaster
22-02-11, 04:43
Do I even want to know what conversation yielded the show's moniker this month? Initial mental image is nauseating. Can't wait to hear it though.

actionmouse
22-02-11, 05:31
This is why this is my favorite podcast. Amazing show. Thanks for coming back to the console extensively on this one. I'm not an arcade or pinball guy at all so I've been missing these type of topics. Class A hardware flashback.
Thanks guys!

miner2049er
23-02-11, 01:24
Do I even want to know what conversation yielded the show's moniker this month? Initial mental image is nauseating. Can't wait to hear it though.

Haha! Not as bad as you might think.

BTW I've found 2 glitches with a clip either side of the Dan Loosen Interview and I will fix it and replace the file on the server so you can hear the interview theme in all its glory.

So far, adobe Audition is doing its best to prevent me fixing the clip.

Glad I didn't pay for it now. :o

GarrickGreathouse
23-02-11, 03:01
Listening to the show and have a couple comments.

CARTS:
The Nintendo Seal of Quality didn't have too much to do with the quality of individual games. Ever play something from LJN?

"Because Nintendo controlled the production of all cartridges, it was able to enforce strict rules on its third-party developers, which were required to sign a contract by Nintendo that would obligate these parties to develop exclusively for the system, order at least 10,000 cartridges, and only make five games per year." -Sheff, David (1993). Game Over. New York: Random House. pp. 214–215. ISBN 0-679-40469-4.

That means any official NES game was a heavy investment for a third party like Capcom or Konami, and for the most party only the best games were released by major third parties (try to think of a bad NES Capcom or Konami game).

It wasn't that Tengen games were bad and got rejected, they simply wanted to release more than 5 games a year without paying extortion fees. They also wanted to release Sega ports on the NES, which Nintendo didn't want.
Retronauts did a great interview with some of the old Tengen crew..
http://www.1up.com/do/blogEntry?bId=9027362


TWITCH:
FPS's aren't Twitch? SoCal must not play online much. I've had many Quake, Unreal, and COD online sessions that were almost heart attack inducing.

Compute
23-02-11, 03:42
Keep up the good work guys! Great show, as usual.

Dhalamar
23-02-11, 05:41
TWITCH:
FPS's aren't Twitch? SoCal must not play online much. I've had many Quake, Unreal, and COD online sessions that were almost heart attack inducing.

Trying to play the original Quake online anymore is like trying to play Counter-Strike ... the majority of the people on there have been playing the game for heaven knows how many years and someone new or just not that good doesn't stand a chance. lol The Unreal games are slightly more forgiving, or maybe I'm just slightly better at Unreal for some reason.

But as far as CoD goes ... I played it quite a bit online recently and the only thing I got out of it was boredom. The only thing "twitchy" about that game is the fact that you can win a firefight by being the one who aims first, shoots, and downing someone with what seems like 2 or 3 bullets from just about anything ... or by hiding in a corner waiting for someone to run by ... which is most of the players I encountered. I actually got kill streaks from going after them a few times. :\

But yeah, SoCal, if you want a "twitchy" FPS ... just get Quake and try to get one lucky frag in a populated online server. The people who are usually there have that damn game down to a science. :P

GarrickGreathouse
23-02-11, 06:37
But yeah, SoCal, if you want a "twitchy" FPS ... just get Quake and try to get one lucky frag in a populated online server. The people who are usually there have that damn game down to a science. :P

I played the demo for Bulletstorm, and that looks like it can get pretty frantic. And of course the Serious Sam games are always nuts.

GarrickGreathouse
23-02-11, 06:42
HIGH SCORES:
Another thing you guys are missing out on in the 21st century!

Thanks to XBox live, I have a constant stream of high score to beat. Games like Need for Speed: Hot Pursuit, Pinball FX, Pac-Man Champions Edition DX and others keep a running scoreboard with you and your friends. It's always right there, punching your ego in it's face meat when your friend overtakes your high score.
Achievement Points (something I don't actually care about) keep track of gameplay challenges, and you can always check your friends Points.

Dhalamar
23-02-11, 07:12
I played the demo for Bulletstorm, and that looks like it can get pretty frantic. And of course the Serious Sam games are always nuts.

Ah, hell yeah.

I'm stuck on ... what I think is ... the last level or close to it. BIG 4 armed sucker walking towards me and tons of those damn bull things.

Duke.Togo
24-02-11, 12:51
HIGH SCORES:
Another thing you guys are missing out on in the 21st century!

Thanks to XBox live, I have a constant stream of high score to beat. Games like Need for Speed: Hot Pursuit, Pinball FX, Pac-Man Champions Edition DX and others keep a running scoreboard with you and your friends. It's always right there, punching your ego in it's face meat when your friend overtakes your high score.
Achievement Points (something I don't actually care about) keep track of gameplay challenges, and you can always check your friends Points.

This was exactly what I was thinking during the segment, but if I remember correctly none of the crew have 360's or LIVE. Online leaderboards really bring back the score competition. I refuse to play garbage games for easy Gamerscore though.

BydoEmpire73
24-02-11, 03:51
I'm not really a fan of the 360 or Live in general, but the online leaderboards are awesome. Largely because it's implemented so well. If it were just global high scores it'd be pretty worthless, but since you can sort by friends it brought back a lot of competition.

GarrickGreathouse
24-02-11, 05:19
This was exactly what I was thinking during the segment, but if I remember correctly none of the crew have 360's or LIVE. Online leaderboards really bring back the score competition. I refuse to play garbage games for easy Gamerscore though.

I cared about gaining Gamer Score for about three hours when I first got my 360. Where it really comes in handy is seeing how far your friends are in games. Did somebody even finish the tutorial before declaring the game was shit? See if he got the "Finish Level 1" achievement.

But as far as using Gamerscore as a type of e-penis length, the entire system was broken out of the gate.

BydoEmpire73
24-02-11, 04:21
There was a lengthy thread on Atari Age (I *think* it was this one (http://www.atariage.com/forums/topic/163658-7800-atari-corp-revival/) but I haven't read back through) about why the 7800 was released so late after being developed. The common (mis)perception as was stated in the HW Flashback was that Tramiel didn't want to be in the console business and held off on the system until the NES caught on, and then released it. Apparently that's not true. What seems to have actually happened was that the 7800's release was tied up in legal issues between Atari Corp and GCC for a couple years after the Tramiels took over the company. Basically Atari wanted to release the console, but couldn't. By the time they were ready to release, Nintendo and its licensees had locked up rights to many of the arcade games of the era so Atari had to dig back to older computer games and older arcade games they already had rights to (some exceptions like Xenophobe, etc). That doesn't explain the god-awful PainLine joysticks, of course. =)

Cynicaster
24-02-11, 06:20
@SoCal: at the risk of sounding pedantic, I must correct a misstatement you made during your Atar-Rewind segment this month.

In the segment, when talking about Kaboom! you misled your entire listenership by telling them that the Mad Bomber's expression "turns to a frown" when the player reaches the milestone of 10,000 points. In fact, any Kaboom-o-phile knows that the Mad Bomber's natural facial expression is a frown. He turns that frown upside down when you let a bomb hit the deck, or when your game ends with a sub-10k score.

When you reach a score of 10k, MB's yap turns to a circular arrangement, as if to say "oooooooo!" in apparent awe of your performance.

So, this raises a very pertinent question, then: have you ever actually surpassed 10k, or are you just trying to sound cool?











(j/k, great segment) :D

BydoEmpire73
24-02-11, 07:42
So, this raises a very pertinent question, then: have you ever actually surpassed 10k, or are you just trying to sound cool?
Ooooh, the gauntlet has been THROWN DOWN! Hehe.

RetroPom
24-02-11, 10:15
YAY! A huge podcast to take my mind off the quake here.... :)
Power came back on yesterday and I was happy to see Yeasty Paste (Yuk!) sitting there - Great work guys
[Though I'm more of a Arcade/Pinball/C64/Amiga person ;) ]

GameGavel
24-02-11, 11:41
YAY! A huge podcast to take my mind off the quake here.... :)
Power came back on yesterday and I was happy to see Yeasty Paste (Yuk!) sitting there - Great work guys
[Though I'm more of a Arcade/Pinball/C64/Amiga person ;) ]

Crap, I forgot you were in NZ. Glad you made it :) How are things looking down there? Better or worse than what we are seeing on TV?

angelbeezy
25-02-11, 02:48
Great show guys. Quick comment at Scott. I was wondering if when you first went to play Super Mario 64 if you uncalibrated the analog stick. When I first got the system when it launched, I got Mario and Pilotwings. The first time I turned it on, I had the controller sitting face down on the couch and it had moved the analog stick off center. So when I turned on the Mario game, it assumed that the direction the stick was in was center, making it impossible to control. I thought I had a broken controller. Mario was doing exactly what you described. I found in the manual the way to fix it was to either turn it off or hold L and R and then press start, which I did and it was re-calibrated and worked perfect. I wonder if thats what happen to you. I have never heard anyone say that Mario 64 had terrible controls. Most people praise it as the first 3D game to do controlling a 3D character right.

Just a thought. Again great show. I look forward to getting more involved on the boards here. I live in So Cal Mike's area. Oh and how to I send ideas for next months news?

SubaruBrat
25-02-11, 02:56
Cool, glad to have another listener in the forums! To submit news just email your item to news@retrogamingroundup.com .

As for Mario 64, those sorts of games have always been hit or miss for me. For example Zelda on the Wii was frustrating to no end when you had the magnetic boots on. SMB Galaxy though had a very intuitive feel, you didn't have to fight the controller. Some of those games agree with me and some don't, but the factor that keeps me from assuming all blame is that I know a 3D game with intuitive directional changes IS possible.

angelbeezy
25-02-11, 03:21
Thanks for the quick reply. Well thats understandable. I don't recall if you mentioned if you ever played through at length or beat Mario 64 but I hope you fought the controls enough to see how varied and great a game it was. I can picture you playing level after level cursing the screen but pushing on because of your love of gaming.

GarrickGreathouse
25-02-11, 03:22
Some of those games agree with me and some don't, but the factor that keeps me from assuming all blame is that I know a 3D game with intuitive directional changes IS possible.

Nothing, and I mean NOTHING was worse than Resident Evil's remote control 'Meat Tank' gameplay. You want a lesson in hair pulling frustration, try playing RE 1 today.

Kombi
25-02-11, 07:11
Happy Birthday guys,
Keep up the great work.
Im still waiting for the return/update of pinball wizard!!!! lol
Anyways another great episode.

ps my dad is retired now and has been clearing out his workshop and has found some of my old handhelds and stuff, will get some photos of them and put them up soon. One of them i had forgotten about a Tri-screen from Vtech called rabbit hop.

miner2049er
25-02-11, 12:38
Oh and how do I send ideas for next months news?

No need to answer as we got your news items, but have a look around our site, we have some images and videos up there for your amusement.

http://www.retrogamingroundup.com

BydoEmpire73
25-02-11, 12:56
Nothing, and I mean NOTHING was worse than Resident Evil's remote control 'Meat Tank' gameplay. You want a lesson in hair pulling frustration, try playing RE 1 today.As your friendly, local Resident Evil fanboy, I'm going to totally disagree. The "tank" controls worked perfectly for the game. Agreed, they're not necessarily intuitive, and every time I bought a new RE game it definitely took me a few minutes to get used to it, but after that it was fine. After that short ramp-up period, the controls became absolute second nature. I don't recall ever dying because the controls were unresponsive or didn't do what I intended to do. And they make perfect sense given the drastic camera angle changes from room to room - pushing "up" to move forward keeps it consistent. It isn't a run and gun action title, you're not supposed to be able to deftly weave in and out of hordes of zombies. You might as well complain about the game being stingy with ammo, or the save points being spread out and limited. Just my 2c.

[Edit]As for Mario 64 - I haven't played it in ages, but I had no issues whatsoever with the controls. They set the standard and they worked exactly like I expected from the first time I played. Yeah, the camera feels a bit clunky, but then so does the camera in almost every 3D platformer. Right up to Epic Micky in 2010. It's a hard problem to solve. Mario Galaxy worked around it by saying screw it and making the levels spherical, removing anything that might block the camera so they didn't have to worry about it. Clever, imho. ;)

BydoEmpire73
25-02-11, 04:28
I liked the cartridge HW Flashback, btw. One that I always thought was cool was the BASIC programming cart for the Bally Astrocade - it included a cassette interface. One other offshoot is the Sega Master System's 3D glasses, which used the card slot as a separate interface. That console was somewhat unique having two cartridge slots.

GarrickGreathouse
25-02-11, 05:49
It isn't a run and gun action title, you're not supposed to be able to deftly weave in and out of hordes of zombies. You might as well complain about the game being stingy with ammo, or the save points being spread out and limited.

So if your not supposed to weave in and out of zombies, and you have very limited ammo and can't shoot them all, what are you suposed to do?

I know! Find CHESS PIECES to unlock the SEWERS in a POLICE STATION filled with ART but not GUNS! And why did the sleepy resort village of Raccoon City have a special forces unit complete with helicopters and anti-tank weaponry?

It's like the first Parasite Eve when they manage to evacuate the ENTIRE island of Manhattan in a matter of hours. You then find yourself in A GUN SHOP with pre-rendered AUTOMATIC WEAPONS HANGING FROM THE WALLS, and it never occurs to any of your characters that they should stock up on guns before the giant demon kills everybody.

God I freaking hate Japanese games..

Cynicaster
25-02-11, 07:33
Nothing, and I mean NOTHING was worse than Resident Evil's remote control 'Meat Tank' gameplay. You want a lesson in hair pulling frustration, try playing RE 1 today.

I'm inclined to agree with you. The only time I ever played one of these games was when I rented the original RE for PS1 back in the late 90's. I thought the "creepiness" aspect was very cool (at least for the time), but I found the game frustrating to the point of being unplayable. And that voice acting.... jeeze, embarrassing.

The "meat tank" controls (haha, I love that) were bad enough, but it was the use of the fixed camera angles instead of the more logical third person "follower" camera that utterly ruined the game for me. In fact, I hated it so much that in the 12 or so years since then I've not once ever had the urge to even look at another RE game. Do they still do the fixed camera thing? I'm assuming not, otherwise I have to think the series would have died a long time ago.

BydoEmpire73
25-02-11, 07:45
I know! Find CHESS PIECES to unlock the SEWERS in a POLICE STATION filled with ART but not GUNS!Exactly!!! Don't fight it, embrace it! If I ever build myself a mansion, I'm going to make sure most of the doors only open by putting specific gems in specific statues, etc.

GarrickGreathouse
25-02-11, 08:31
I'm inclined to agree with you. The only time I ever played one of these games was when I rented the original RE for PS1 back in the late 90's. I thought the "creepiness" aspect was very cool (at least for the time), but I found the game frustrating to the point of being unplayable. And that voice acting.... jeeze, embarrassing.

The "meat tank" controls (haha, I love that) were bad enough, but it was the use of the fixed camera angles instead of the more logical third person "follower" camera that utterly ruined the game for me. In fact, I hated it so much that in the 12 or so years since then I've not once ever had the urge to even look at another RE game. Do they still do the fixed camera thing? I'm assuming not, otherwise I have to think the series would have died a long time ago.

RE 4 dropped the pre-rendered backgrounds and static cameras. RE 4 is a GREAT game, and I've heard that the Wii version is really good.

I don't really hold RE 1 to the same scrutiny as the other 'pre 4' games. The PSX was still young, and it was the most ambitious game of it kind at the time. However Capcom learned nothing, and RE 2 was a hodgepodge of bad writing and puzzles from cutting room floor of RE 1.

miner2049er
25-02-11, 08:45
RE4 is one of the best games I've ever played, but RE1 is almost unplayable today because of the primitive controls. I thought they were fine at the time but going back to it now, they are bad. The DS version got slammed for having crappy controls but they just mimicked the original.

Cynicaster
26-02-11, 06:27
What system(s) have RE4, and what is the latest iteration? Sorry, but I'm embarrassingly ignorant of this series and I'm too lazy to google it.

Dhalamar
26-02-11, 06:45
What system(s) have RE4, and what is the latest iteration? Sorry, but I'm embarrassingly ignorant of this series and I'm too lazy to google it.

RE 4 :
Gamecube
Wii
PS2

And the latest that I'm aware of is 5 for the PC, 360 and PS3.

miner2049er
26-02-11, 07:28
Play it on Wii, it is essentially the Gamecube version but with better controls and minor enhancements.

GarrickGreathouse
26-02-11, 10:15
And you really shouldn't bother with RE 5. It took the annoying aspects of four and built an entire game around it.

Dhalamar
27-02-11, 01:14
And you really shouldn't bother with RE 5. It took the annoying aspects of four and built an entire game around it.

And, from what little I remember of the demo, if you like to run AND shoot at the same time in a modern game, you're SOL. heh

tcv
27-02-11, 02:10
Play it on Wii, it is essentially the Gamecube version but with better controls and minor enhancements.

Wow! I hear your voice clearly when I read this...

miner2049er
27-02-11, 02:26
Wow! I hear your voice clearly when I read this...

My work here is done.

Burgertime
27-02-11, 05:21
I remember when RE5 was being trashed on left and right from critics for not being able to run and shoot at the same time. Then they looked at Dead Space and said "See! This is what you should be able to do!" Personally, I liked RE5 for what it was.

With so many of the games on the N64 list getting 3DS versions, I got to wondering what other series they revive. I'm sure Golden Eye or Perfect Dark would work well in 3D, as would Mario 64. Getting newer, I'd love to see Pikmin on there, and imagine how much more vertigo people would get from a Mario Galaxy 3DS title would produce.

GarrickGreathouse
27-02-11, 09:25
I remember when RE5 was being trashed on left and right from critics for not being able to run and shoot at the same time. Then they looked at Dead Space and said "See! This is what you should be able to do!" Personally, I liked RE5 for what it was.

With so many of the games on the N64 list getting 3DS versions, I got to wondering what other series they revive. I'm sure Golden Eye or Perfect Dark would work well in 3D, as would Mario 64. Getting newer, I'd love to see Pikmin on there, and imagine how much more vertigo people would get from a Mario Galaxy 3DS title would produce.

It wasn't just and antique shooting solution. The brain dead AI partner was also a real problem, always getting in the way and wasting your health.

I've also heard from hands on reports that the DSI is a bit wonky to actually use. The device must be held in the exact spot at all times. But the big problem comes from moving your eyes from 3D screen, to the bottom 2D screen for maps and menus, then back to the 3D screen. Your eyes have to re-adjust every time.

In two yeas, I see 80% of 3DS games ignoring the 3D altogether.

RetroPom
28-02-11, 10:09
Crap, I forgot you were in NZ. Glad you made it :) How are things looking down there? Better or worse than what we are seeing on TV?

Hi there - Pretty shit to be honest. Thank god it's still summer here....Just.
My work building - that I was evacuated from when it happened - is literally 2mins walk from the CTV building that totally collapsed.
Got power now - had it for a few days. But no running water yet - Will be a week tomorrow!
Will try and post some pics - Only on Hardware Flashback so far.....Bit too consoley for me this month as I hinted ;)
It's good as always though - so keep it up.
Pretty much all the publically playable pinballs and arcade games cordoned off in the Central Business District - and many of them may have been destroyed. Pretty insignificant amongst all the deaths - but still a little sad...
http://www.gamegavel.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4077
RIP :(

saberman
02-03-11, 07:04
Exactly!!! Don't fight it, embrace it! If I ever build myself a mansion, I'm going to make sure most of the doors only open by putting specific gems in specific statues, etc.

:) If I ever do I'm going to have a huge party, wake up with a hang over and get a housecleaner that won’t let me go to bed until I clean up all the mess myself!

saberman
02-03-11, 07:06
Another great show thanks again guys.

I have to say the British hour was very very funny, if a little short :o).

I also really like SoCal’s Atari-Rewind segment. It really got me thinking about twitch gaming. There were a few I could “zone out” playing back in the day but not many. As for modern games one genera that could qualify is the Guitar Hero/Rock Band games. They really are a continual assault where you have to zone out to survive, at last at the higher difficulties.

The top ten was as good as usual and for me is the highlight of every show.

miner2049er
02-03-11, 07:35
:) If I ever do I'm going to have a huge party, wake up with a hang over and get a housecleaner that won’t let me go to bed until I clean up all the mess myself!

[/waits to see if anybody across the pond gets the reference.]

GarrickGreathouse
04-03-11, 03:23
[/waits to see if anybody across the pond gets the reference.]

Jet Set Willy?

miner2049er
04-03-11, 05:51
Jet Set Willy?

Damn straight!

Byte Knight
05-03-11, 02:14
Weird - I just got my retro GAMER magazine today and on the cover is the Nintendo 64 and inside is a feature on the history of Duke Nukem. Must be UK Mike's influence...

My experience with the N64 was very brief - I bought one early in its life cycle, played a crapload of Turok and Wave Race, then traded it in at a Funco Land for a PS 1 because of a lack of games. I might have to try it again after this episode!

Chris
05-03-11, 05:31
I just finished up the yeasty paste, another great episode.

saberman
05-03-11, 12:25
Weird - I just got my retro GAMER magazine today and on the cover is the Nintendo 64 and inside is a feature on the history of Duke Nukem. Must be UK Mike's influence...



That happened to me too. I was actually listening to the N64 top ten when I open the mag and saw the N64 on the front.

eldphm
09-03-11, 10:28
Regarding Bill Paxton Pinball, it is a great choice for a pinball theme. He fought Arnold in the beginning of "The Terminator", fought aliens in "Aliens", fought predators in "Predator 2" and helped a little old lady in "Titanic".

Should be very easy to find qoutes for soundbytes ("Hey Vasquez, have you ever been mistaken for a man?").

A very qoutable actor, but you could say that about Val Kilmer too :P
(why they didn't do a game from Top Secret or Real Genious is a mystery to me.)

Currently following up on Ben Hecks pinball wars with Jeri Ellsworth, both on his homepage and his show on revision3.

On a totally different subject, as a Swede, I must object to the comment that Dolph Lundgren has a German accent, his birthname being Hans does not make him german.
I don't think he is the guy to play Duke though, maybe 10 years ago.

Great show, again.

zxspectrum16k
10-03-11, 04:31
Big congrats on the two year anniversary, great show as ever.
N64 for me was all about 3 games, Mario64, Turuk and my personal fav Waveracer. I ploughed so many hrs into waveracer and completed it on the console, and later on emulation. The feel of controlling the jetski was just epic, amazing. It just felt so good when you managed to get your speed up and skimmed across the waves. Also the jumps and landing, WOOWWWW just spot on. Wave racer for me was when i first noticed the use of sun blur, as i turned the corner the glare of the sun hit me. WOW moment. I havent played it in years, but from my memory I do remember it been f*cking awesome control and the best water control vehicle ever.
But I also remember 'Match Point' having the best tennis controls i have ever played.

Think i will have a n64 weekend, and see how the hold up. I was never interested in Golden Eye/Perfect Dark as at that stage i was playing multiplayer fps on the pc.

Also another nod to 'When is the return of pinball wizard happening?' a followup or new story?