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miner2049er
23-09-10, 12:16
Run for your lives! The September Podcast is out!

Take a look behind the scenes here at RetroGaming ROundUp and see for yourselves the depths of SoCal's treachery.
Oh the Humanity!

Editorial On Real or Emulated - (00:00)
Hardware Flashback - (23:58)
Guinness Gaming Records - (53:37)
Keith Robinson Part 2 - (54:57)
The British Hour - (109:18)
Top Ten Intellivision Games - (135:18)
Top Ten Rebuttal - (241:53)
Atar-Rewind (243:54)
Gaming Trivia - (258:15)
News And Mailbag - (259:00)
URLS And Emails - (342:16)

As always, See the shownotes (http://www.retrogamingroundup.com/shownotes/2010/roundup023_2010.09.htm) page. Donate (http://www.retrogamingroundup.com/donate.htm) to the show.
Join our Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/pages/RetroGamingRoundup/121368478521) Group. Listen to the September Outtakes (http://www.retrogamingroundup.com/roundups/2010/RoundUp023_Outtakes.mp3).

Leathco
23-09-10, 01:14
Downloaded, listening now. From the outtakes it sounds like there was a war on the Inty Top Ten.

miner2049er
23-09-10, 01:55
It got heated alright, but that is nothing to what awaits you in The News.

meu2
23-09-10, 02:21
Sounds interesting to say the least :D

Dhalamar
23-09-10, 02:32
It got heated alright, but that is nothing to what awaits you in The News.

I see some of the shit I submitted in the links. heh

miner2049er
23-09-10, 03:21
It is all there, everything submitted is on the site and we talk about most of it.

Leathco
23-09-10, 05:18
First up, thanks for the awesome interview with Keith Robinson. I original thought I'd just be marginally interested in it, as the Inty was before my time (I was an NES guy early on) but it was really, really thought provoking and good. I'd love a chance to sit and talk with the man myself.

And I emulate everything I can, but I also keep all my original consoles, even if they were just stored in a box I'd keep em. Great memories in all of em. I actually have a corner of my bedroom with an old TV and all my old consoles hooked up to it, with a dresser full of accessories and a couple bookcases full of games. I'm definately the collector type. But gaming takes all kinds.

GameGavel
23-09-10, 10:05
Keith Robinson wants us to make sure you all know that GameStop IS in fact going to sell Intellivision Lives DS. He made a mistake saying they weren't and is now trying to correct this everywhere he can. So disregard our comments about it during our podcast.

GarrickGreathouse
24-09-10, 12:53
In that "Mario is Screwed" picture? That's Guile from Street Fighter 2 (my favorite game of all time, I might add).

Are you guys ever going to get around to covering more of the Japanese side of classic gaming?
Things like Nihon Falcom games? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nihon_Falcom They released a ton of their games in the US and Europe over the years. Series like Dragon Slayer, Ys, and Brandish.

Did you know that in Japan, the NES is remembered for it's older and more simplistic games like Atlantis No Nazo? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ebUd2ud-yk All the great games we remember like Bionic Commando and Ninja Gaiden were late to the game over in Japan and were never as popular as the older stuff.

Also, what about the Turbografx 16? Why no love?

miner2049er
24-09-10, 09:03
In that "Mario is Screwed" picture? That's Guile from Street Fighter 2 (my favorite game of all time, I might add).

Haha! Yeah I got an email from a disgusted Flare saying the same thing. I just never liked the game but I guessed he was from one of the Street Fighters.


Are you guys ever going to get around to covering more of the Japanese side of classic gaming?

It isn't an area I know a lot about but Scott and I were talking offline about Japan and said we have to plan a RGRUP trip just to explore the whole scene. I know it's an area we haven't got to yet but it is on the radar for the future.

If you wanna shoot me an email with some more links for me to explore it may get bumped up the schedule (assuming we have a planned schedule of course).


Also, what about the Turbografx 16? Why no love?

Now that is higher up the planned schedule that we don't have because I'm already working on it, so it will appear at some point as a review type segment, and also we have a Top Ten for it in the pipeline too so it hasn't been forgotten about.

GameGavel
24-09-10, 04:21
Ya, I know nothing about the Japanese retro gaming scene, but would like to learn more. We will be doing this show for quite a while so I think it will get touched upon sooner or later. Also, I LOVE the TG-16 so it will def be getting more love as we move forward.

Flare
24-09-10, 04:43
Haha! Yeah I got an email from a disgusted Flare saying the same thing. I just never liked the game but I guessed he was from one of the Street Fighters.Every time you see Guile crouching for more than 2 seconds and you make the mistake of jumping towards him, you know you're screwed.

Gordon Bennett
24-09-10, 05:27
It got heated alright, but that is nothing to what awaits you in The News.

I understand the frustration that both of you had with his behaviour. On the other hand, if I was in that situation and it was an Old Firm derby I would have done the exact same thing. With due advance warning of time.

GameGavel
24-09-10, 06:01
In me defense, normally we do our recordings during the week. And I did warn them upfront that there was a chance I would leave early. They only had like 5 news stories left :) And it was the first "tv" game from the Nebraksa Cornhuskers and living out here in Cali we don't get many of the Nebraksa games on tv so I have to see them when they are on. They were just giving me shit anyway :)

Gordon Bennett
24-09-10, 08:44
Like I said, I do uderstand. As much as I love retro games, life has to have more to it. Sport is one of them, and as my avatar shows I'm not afraid to mix interests, for good or for bad.

Which reminds me. A guy I sort of knew was found dead two years ago wearing black lace stockings, suspenders, and a pink feather boa. There was a rope wrapped tightly around his neck. He was found holding his greased up cock in one hand and a nipple clamp in the other.

Funny thing was, the autopsy eventually ruled that he had actually died of a brain aneurysm under fairly normal circumstances. The thing is, he died wearing a Rangers shirt so his mates set up the scene as described in order to avoid embarrassment to his family.

miner2049er
24-09-10, 10:48
LOL, I suspect that few people over the Atlantic will get that joke.

I thought of a segment a while back which would be me telling a joke that nobody in the US would understand but I could only think of about 5.

Here's one:


I'm not saying my wife is fat, but when she fell down the stairs last night, I thought Eastenders was starting!

GarrickGreathouse
24-09-10, 11:59
Ya, I know nothing about the Japanese retro gaming scene, but would like to learn more. We will be doing this show for quite a while so I think it will get touched upon sooner or later. Also, I LOVE the TG-16 so it will def be getting more love as we move forward.

The problem with the Japanese classic gaming scene is that it's rapidly drying up. I'd say that 2003 was the heyday with used stores and retro love, but video game popularity in japan has cooled down across the board. Japanese developers are trying to make western style games to sell in the US and Europe simply because they don't make money in their homeland. There are exceptions, sure, but it's rare to see a non-Nintendo Japanese developed game post any significant sales in America and Europe.

Back to the topic at hand, the Japanese side of gaming in the 80's and early 90's was crazy. It would take hours just to crack the surface, but here's a good place to start...

When many of our favorite NES games were brought from Japan to US/Europe,animation, graphics, and even sound elements from memory to save cost. Contra (aka Gryzor in Japan) has Ninja Giaden style cut scenes that were removed from the US Version.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jk3vEiKrMPs

Konami used special sound chips in a lot of their Famicom games, and these were always removed when the US version was produced. Listen to how awsome the Japanese version of Castlevania 3 sounds compared to the NES.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=14rPeAy6gDA
Castlevania 3 also had special chips for graphics that were removed, so the NES version had half the animation.

However, in Japan cart based games cost around $70 to $100 bucks each in American 1989 money.

If people are interested, I'll post more stuff, but I have to run now.

Duke.Togo
25-09-10, 12:18
For some nice info on classic JP gaming, Famicom Dojo is a fun place for basic info. Also, I wouldn't normally plug other podcasts here but since they are shutting down, I recommend Retronauts. Jeremy Parish is very knowledgable, and his site www.gamespite.net is great. Just a few to give you a start.

GarrickGreathouse
25-09-10, 12:39
Retronauts is an amazing podcast! Each episode is like a lecture to me. I can go back and listen multiple times and get new information with each subsequent listen.

Favorite Retronauts episodes are 75 (TurboGrafx-16) and 98 (the PAX NES episode).

SubaruBrat
25-09-10, 02:04
I had to google the Old Firm Derby ref......

Duke.Togo
25-09-10, 03:16
I'm about half way through so far. I had the same thoughts about the Colecovision and why no one is around to talk about development for it. The thoughts about Japanese development would make some sense. I would think especially in the case of the SEGA ports since the SG-1000 is virtually the same hardware from what I understand. I'd love to hear more about all of this if it can be found out.

BydoEmpire73
25-09-10, 01:26
Interesting editorial UK. I sold a chunk of my collection a few years ago to help finance my music studio - I sold my Saturn, N64 and Colecovision collections, along w/ a random selection of ps2 and Xbox games.

I simply never played the N64 anymore. I loved the system when it was current, I had a LOT of (boxed) games and really enjoyed them, but imho it hasn't held up well. Low FPS 3d games are a little irritating on my eyes, and games I wanted for it I've already played. I kept waiting to click with the Colecovision, but it never happened. It always seemed very choppy to me, and while there were a few games I came back to consistently - Buck Rogers and Venture - as a whole the system never grabbed me. The CV was one of my least-played pre-crash systems so I didn't feel bad about letting it go (and i had some rare titles so I got decent money for it). That said, I ended up buying another CV cheap a year or so later, but the only games I have are Space Fury and Donkey Kong.

The Saturn was a tough one. I got it late, I think after the DC, but I really enjoyed it. Games like Dragon Force, Panzer Dragoon Saga, Sega Rally and Guardian Heroes made it absolutely worth owning. If you just play Playstation ports you're missing out on the best the system has to offer, so I wouldn't consider it a "poor man's Playstation." I was a great, quirky console that had a lot of unique titles. Kind of like the SMS compared to the NES. That said, I had a collection that was worth a fair bit of money and I just didn't play it that often.

I don't regret selling any of those. I also decided to focus on having more games for fewer systems. I still have about 10 hooked up right now, and a few others packed away (the O2, CV, SNES and Bally Astrocade). I don't like to sell things unless it's for a specific reason. Sure I might be able to get $20 for my O2 stuff, but what's that going to get me? Piddle it away on lunch or gas? At some point - maybe a few years from now - I'm going to want to play KC Munchkin, and I"ll be glad I didn't get rid of the O2 with nothing to show for it.

As for emulation, to me it's no substitute. I'll use an emulator to check out a MAME game since there's no alternative, or play an emulated game I don't own for Atari Age's high score clubs, but I just don't enjoy old console games on the PC. It's missing a big part of the experience. I like browsing through my carts, I like the click of a cartridge snapped into the slot, I like playing on the real controllers, and I especially like playing on a real tube TV. I've been playing a lot of 5200 and Intellivision lately, and those two systems' controllers are tough to replace on an emulator. I have bought a fair number of TG16 games for the Wii's Virtual Console because I no longer have a TG16 and there were a lot of games I wanted to play but never got when I owned it (I sold that system ages ago). I've also enjoyed a number of classic game compilations for various systems over the years; but in general, emulating games on a PC doesn't do anything for me.

Gordon Bennett
25-09-10, 05:29
LOL, I suspect that few people over the Atlantic will get that joke.

I thought of a segment a while back which would be me telling a joke that nobody in the US would understand but I could only think of about 5.

Here's one:


I'm not saying my wife is fat, but when she fell down the stairs last night, I thought Eastenders was starting!

Good one. Better than the one I had in mind:

What's the difference between a soldier and a fireman?
You can't dip a fireman into your boiled egg.

miner2049er
25-09-10, 07:30
LOL.

OK, you convinced me, I'm gonna tell one in the next roundup, well, probably November actually, and you can listen for Scott and SoCal's reactions, or lack of.

Leathco
26-09-10, 01:59
I wanna hear what payback is for Mike. Surely more than a few surly facebook messages.....

miner2049er
26-09-10, 02:31
Oh he had plenty payback, Scott and I recorded a while after he left just shooting the breeze and waiting for his re-appearance after the first quarter ;)

That's why you hear me say to Scott that we were going "back on the record" so he knew we would be putting that bit in the show.

SoCal will pay for his treachery LOL, maybe in the next Top Ten. ;)

BydoEmpire73
26-09-10, 04:41
Really enjoyed part 2 of the Keith Robinson. I was never quite clear on all the versions of the Inty, so it was really cool to have him explain how they all came about.

GarrickGreathouse
26-09-10, 07:47
Really enjoyed part 2 of the Keith Robinson. I was never quite clear on all the versions of the Inty, so it was really cool to have him explain how they all came about.

I know I'm going to piss off a few people here, but I've never understood the appeal of Intellivision games. I never played a real Intellivision console, but I've played Intellivision Lives for the Gamecube and several Intellivision games on Microsoft Gameroom. I find that the controls are non-responsive across the board, the graphics and music to be only marginally better than it's rivals at the time, and many of the games are far to complicated or obtuse for the hardware and interface.

SubaruBrat
26-09-10, 08:05
I think the original hardware helps, the controller has a very specific feel to it. Having the manual on some games can be beneficial a little more often on this system as well.

Gordon Bennett
26-09-10, 09:08
The original hardware helps tremendously. I have Intellivision Lives for the Gamecube and it really doesn't replicate the experience at all. It's no fault of the programmers, the controller is simply too far removed from the original. I expect that the DS version will improve things considerably. While the original disc controller won't be there, it will at least be able to replicate the keypad and overlays.

Several of the games, particularly the more complex ones, really do need the overlay in order to familiarise you with the controls. Memorising buttons scattered across a gamepad overly complicates it.

Duke.Togo
26-09-10, 09:11
I know I'm going to piss off a few people here, but I've never understood the appeal of Intellivision games. I never played a real Intellivision console, but I've played Intellivision Lives for the Gamecube and several Intellivision games on Microsoft Gameroom. I find that the controls are non-responsive across the board, the graphics and music to be only marginally better than it's rivals at the time, and many of the games are far to complicated or obtuse for the hardware and interface.

I think that the Inty looks much better with rosy nostalgia tinted glasses. I played it to death when it was originally out, so it means a lot to me. In its heyday the only thing I had to compare it to was the 2600, which was a glaring distinction.

I would also agree with Scott that the original hardware is where it should be enjoyed. The disc on the controller gave it a distinctive feel that a D-pad wouldn't replicate.

My only issue with that generation was the inserts. Why did the 5200/Coleco/Inty all have them? Thankfully that idea died in the crash (except for Jaguar, but hey).

Joshua B
27-09-10, 11:14
Thank you guys! I really enjoyed the Avatar pin talk and the Keith Robinson part 2. UK Mike, in the 91, 91, and 92 there was quite a club scene in Boston, MA following the Manchester music scene so I loved your segment on Madchester.

Chris
28-09-10, 12:46
So I only have 14 minutes left in the show, what a great episode though. For the record, my wife's name is Bre but it's not the same Bree from Video Masters, haha. I'm on Video Masters myself.

I don't blame SoCal for leaving to go watch the game!

Thanks for alerting me to the Atari Greatest Hits on the DS, I am soooooo buying that one (and there's a vol. 2 coming as well!)

Scott, you might be interested to know that the Wright Brothers are my great great uncles. My grandmother's mother was my great grandmother Wright and I knew her until she died when I was about 13. She was their niece of course.

I enjoyed the trip through the UK, I definitely need to get over there sometime. Can't wait to hear the USA one. I have some stuff to contribute about PA if you are interested....

SubaruBrat
28-09-10, 02:05
Freakin cool!

miner2049er
28-09-10, 08:37
For the record, my wife's name is Bre but it's not the same Bree from Video Masters, haha.

Apologies, I saw the name Bre and assumed without reading on.


I have some stuff to contribute about PA if you are interested....

Well as I've only sat in the airport terminal at Philadelphia (one of the worst in the world), sure, send it to me through email.

GameGavel
28-09-10, 09:55
First off, great editorial from UK this month - :CLP

Here are my beliefs when it comes to the ago old argument, real or emulated. I can certainly see UK's viewpoint on this, but at the same time, even though I have various emulators I start off playing them, but then always migrate back to the real thing. My dedicated cabs get significant more play then games on my Mame Cab, even though I have thousands of games on there. My dedicated consoles get more play than do the same games on my GP2X. I simply have to have the real systems, mainly because nostalgia carries so much weight with me and nostalgia for me has two components; the game and the hardware. Playing old games on emulated hardware doesn't bring back as many memories as playing the actual games, on their actual carts or disks on actual consoles using the actual control devices.

I think one of the reasons it works for me to own the consoles, is #1 they are all pretty much readily accessible to me at the So Cal swap meets. I literally find games and systems all the time. Even enough that I can pick and choose which ones I keep (the nice ones) and sell (the rougher ones). Next I have a great setup to play multiple consoles. I have a 42" big screen in my arcade that happens to be very "classic console friendly" as it has multiple AV outlets as well as the old school RF inputs. So I can literally have about 6 systems all hooked up to it at one time, then I can just switch between each system basically at the press of a button.

My console collection now consists of: Atari 2600, Atari Jaguar, Sega Genesis w/ CD and Master System Converter, Sega Dreamcast, Sega Saturn (more on this), Colecovision, Intellivision, Bally Astrocade, Super NES, NES, N64, Vectrex, Commodore 64, Timex Sinclair 1000 & 1500 and Apple IIc. There are a few systems currently missing including a Turbo Grafx-16 which I plan on adding and keeping the next time I come across one. And I have had many Atari 7800s and 5200s come and go over the years, but never play them enough to keep them.

As far as the Sega Saturn goes. I too, thought it was a system that I could easily pass up. But after finding one at a garage sale with a great selection of some of its best games, including - Golden Axe: The Duel, Dragon Force, Nights into Dreams, Panzer Dragoon Zwei, Mr. Bones. And I've picked up a few games on GameGavel like - Shining The Holy Ark. Just these games alone make the Saturn a very worthwhile system to own. Especially, since there are quite a few others that are considered great games that I have yet to acquire.

I do agree, there is no reason to have a system and tons of games if you never plan on playing them. I think many of us have games and systems in that category, but why? Get out that system that you haven't played in a year. Go find a couple new games for it and give it some love! You will be glad you did.

Chris
29-09-10, 12:22
Yeah for me, I keep systems that have a meaning or other special value to me. I keep my SNES because it's very special to me, Nintendo actually gave it to my father before the SNES launch and I'll never forget what it felt like to get a "new console" for free. So that's a great memory and I'd never get rid of that SNES. The N64 carried me through much of college, I spent almost all 4 years toting that from dorm to dorm and I have a ton of great memories playing NHL 99, doing Goldeneye multiplayer (which was huuuuge at the time), and of course the tons of time spent playing multiplayer Mario Kart 64 (some of them got legitimately heated, which is silly thinking back on, but we got extremely competitive with Mario Kart because we all played it so much and got so good at it). I also have great memories playing Donkey Kong 64 and Dr. Mario 64 with my girlfriend (who became my wife). So the N64 has a ton of great memories attached to it.

I just can't part with my original Gameboy. I never use it, but it's just this landmark system that represents a time when playing mobile Nintendo games was indiscernible from magic for me.

Years ago I donated my NES and all my games to a children's section at the local hospital. I'm glad I did that, and I don't regret it, but I do look back and sometimes wince because I wouldn't mind having that today. I also sold my Sega Master System and all my games (with light phaser) on Ebay. THAT I DO regret. I miss my Master System, but I needed the money at the time.

meu2
29-09-10, 09:26
The N64 carried me through much of college, I spent almost all 4 years toting that from dorm to dorm and I have a ton of great memories playing NHL 99, doing Goldeneye multiplayer (which was huuuuge at the time), and of course the tons of time spent playing multiplayer Mario Kart 64 (some of them got legitimately heated, which is silly thinking back on, but we got extremely competitive with Mario Kart because we all played it so much and got so good at it).

Isn’t it amazing how Goldeneye and Mario Kart sessions could get so competitive and heated? It felt like it was so important at the time, but looking back does seem a little silly.


I also have great memories playing Donkey Kong 64 and Dr. Mario 64 with my girlfriend (who became my wife).

So those that make Mario a love doctor?

Leathco
29-09-10, 11:27
Me and an ex used to play tons of Goldeneye and Starfox competitively. Great fun. Another ex and I played Mario Kart a lot. Strangely, my wife isn't much of a gamer, other than Bookworm, Bejeweled, stuff like that. She actually got me a bit more involved in those two, I rather like them. But crap like Suduku and Mahjong I still hate with a passion.

Strangely, she don't care much for the more classic puzzlers, like Tetris or Marble madness, but she likes stuff like Mercury.

saberman
29-09-10, 01:04
Listening to the top ten debate I’m suspicious that Mike, Scott and Mike are subtly orchestrating the ‘break up’ Scott mentioned a few months ago. UK Mike assures me that is not the case if anyone else had similar thoughts :).

Although that could be an elaborate double bluff…

Leathco
29-09-10, 01:35
Listening to the top ten debate I’m suspicious that Mike, Scott and Mike are subtly orchestrating the ‘break up’ Scott mentioned a few months ago. UK Mike assures me that is not the case if anyone else had similar thoughts :).

Although that could be an elaborate double bluff…

No ones going anywhere. Its kinda like a lovers spat.....

F-zero
29-09-10, 09:38
Great episode so far, i'm somewhere in the middle of the top 10 debate.
Hats of to Uk Mike for his music selection this month "Some banging tunes there our kid"

Regarding hardware or emulation, for me it has to be hardware.
Emulation kills the feel of the games for me and its never perfect, the picture is either scaled (not native res) or too clear (eg 2600) or not centered properly.
My friend has the best emulation set up i've seen, vga to rgb scart with as near to native resolutions as he can get but the difference is still there, not as noticeable in some emulators as others but enought to put me of.

That being said, for systems i can't own, arcade games etc i'll happily emulate as i have no other choice.
I'm not against emulation, i actually think its great for keeping the classics alive but if i could own them all i would, my own arcade, :DRL

SubaruBrat
29-09-10, 09:51
No ones going anywhere. Its kinda like a lovers spat.....

Just our usual ball breaking to keep it interesting.

saberman
01-10-10, 11:20
Just our usual ball breaking to keep it interesting.

Iíve listened to the news now and Iíve even less convinced it isnít a set up. I just canít believe So Cal would betray the show for a display of soft core homoerotica then start posting on facebook while heís was supposed to be watching the all important first televised game of the season. Shame on you if you did young man :o).

Although the whole thing did gave me a mental image of him still watching it in grubby undies with ĎThe Lions and the Cucumberí by ĎVampireís sound incorporationí on in the background while he was watching it to :D.

SubaruBrat
01-10-10, 02:08
Oh, that part was real, he really did jump early for the game. He said he was going to do it before we started and we were somewhat incredulous when he actually did it. I had been up for about 48 hours, worked mids, had to pick up the kitten from being neutered, had a raging head cold, took a double dose of nyquill at 10:00am and was so passed out Socal had to call and wake me for the news. Rather than take sick day I showed up, and then he leaved for a mamby pamby touch fest. And poor UK, he had to stay up late on a work night. So yeah we busted his balls for actually leaving to watch the game but my point was nobody was actually "mad" at him, just situational appropriate shit talking.

saberman
01-10-10, 02:28
... but my point was nobody was actually "mad" at him, just situational appropriate shit talking.

You sounded Mad at the time mate. OK you've convinced me it isn't a set up and I'm glad you are all OK now.

Dhalamar
01-10-10, 02:59
Kind of reminded me of when Scott was calling people douche bags in the Planet M.U.L.E. chat room for not wanting to be in a game with the new guy (aka me) :P

SubaruBrat
01-10-10, 04:14
Yeah, I gave them a talking to.

GameGavel
01-10-10, 05:51
First off, we are all getting along great. So no worries there. In case some of you haven't noticed, we like do dish out the shit on one another occasionally. Next, again you have to all understand our recording times. Usually during the week, during my work day, no less. So while I am doing the top-10 I am also fielding phone calls and doing engineering/cad drawings for my customers at the same time. Imagine if Scott or UK did this while they were working. It won't happen. I am fortunate enough to work at home and can do this during my work day making our recordings achievable. Second, I work close to 80 hours each week combining my real job with GameGavel and anytime Tricia wants my undivided attention for a few hours, she gets it. And while I was watching the game, I was on my iPad keeping tabs on GameGavel and the forums. I just can't record while watching a football game as I would be distracted and it would be noisy, so having skype on my iPad really doesn't matter. Hell, UK and Scott get on me for typing during our recordings :BONK:

And don't be fooled by my co-hosts. They to have either skipped out on some news segments alltogether or missed sections of it and were then edited in like they were there so me leaving with around 15 minutes of news left out of a two hour recording isn't anything :)

gavv
01-10-10, 09:11
great show. it was my first encounter with the top ten process as I generally go piecemeal through shows and really enjoyed the Keith R interview as well. With the hiatus in CGE and demise of RGRadio, I miss the long in depth interview segments and love to hear more of them. Even though i saw my first CGE Intv panel in 2002, I still find out new things every time I hear them speak.

Some Intellivision notes/comments :)
It's interesting the game choices and how emulation played a role in choosing them, as due to it's extreme rarity, I
dont' think Congo Bongo would have been any one of the hosts choice without it purely being around on emulation.

Tower of Doom was originally AD&D 3. It was started at Mattel, abandoned when Mattel crashed, finished with INTV. i.e. no longer could afford to, or legally able to keep the license. Many licensed games came out in different forms under INTV in new/unlicensed forms like the '2nd gen' sports titles and all.

I think the one host's dismissal of Happy Trails as simple 'like some cheap plastic throwaway game' is kind of like saying Tetris isn't much of a game since it's based around kids stacking blocks. HT while derivative of Locomotion style gameplay, is infinitely more complex as a strategy game.

Utopia isn't turn based strategy, it's what I like to call round-based strategy. Everything inside each round is real-time including all the building/fishing, just the rounds play more into how the game's scorekeeping is handled. I think it was given a bit of a short shrift in the top ten. It was not only a possibly fiercly competitive game, with near infinite customizability in terms of scoring structure, (and you coudl also do wetware 'house rules' like 'no sending rebels') you could play it as essentially a co-op game. It was near the perfect melding of gameplay and Inty controller design.

Thunder Castle is an awesome melding of pac man and lode runner like game styling, music and graphics, qutie amazing. and I'm not just saying that since I hold the world record on it :).

My 'honorable mentions':
Burgertime - for pure arcade maze game play, nothing is finer, and control and timing wise, the Inty version is amazing.
Triple Action - for purely the bi-planes alone, the most competitive multiplayer game on the platform.
MLB Baseball - killer original pack-in game, innovative early use of full controller.



I thought the top ten process was a bit odd and a bit flawed coming at it the first time, since it would appear to me that there's no way any one of the first 2 hosts would ever have a title placed outside the top ten when first discussed (being too charitable early syndrome) and with trying to place into strict-ish slots right off the bat, it almost predetermines on the other hand, that the last presenter will have the #1 game to slot in. I'd say either do the presenting rotating wise so that not all 4 games of one host are done at a time, or put them 'in or out' and if in, compare them to each one that's already in to slot them above or below. dunno, sorry if this is way overdicusses, thsi is my first time posting here :)

thanks muchly
Ryan Gavigan
gavv

SubaruBrat
01-10-10, 09:23
The top ten format has been one of our most successful bits, in that format. In part because there is no charity, a bad pick will get you shellacked. And should a better pick arrive a previous pick can and will get booted with a vengeance.

GameGavel
01-10-10, 09:35
great show. it was my first encounter with the top ten process as I generally go piecemeal through shows and really enjoyed the Keith R interview as well. With the hiatus in CGE and demise of RGRadio, I miss the long in depth interview segments and love to hear more of them. Even though i saw my first CGE Intv panel in 2002, I still find out new things every time I hear them speak.

Some Intellivision notes/comments :)
It's interesting the game choices and how emulation played a role in choosing them, as due to it's extreme rarity, I
dont' think Congo Bongo would have been any one of the hosts choice without it purely being around on emulation.

Tower of Doom was originally AD&D 3. It was started at Mattel, abandoned when Mattel crashed, finished with INTV. i.e. no longer could afford to, or legally able to keep the license. Many licensed games came out in different forms under INTV in new/unlicensed forms like the '2nd gen' sports titles and all.

I think the one host's dismissal of Happy Trails as simple 'like some cheap plastic throwaway game' is kind of like saying Tetris isn't much of a game since it's based around kids stacking blocks. HT while derivative of Locomotion style gameplay, is infinitely more complex as a strategy game.

Utopia isn't turn based strategy, it's what I like to call round-based strategy. Everything inside each round is real-time including all the building/fishing, just the rounds play more into how the game's scorekeeping is handled. I think it was given a bit of a short shrift in the top ten. It was not only a possibly fiercly competitive game, with near infinite customizability in terms of scoring structure, (and you coudl also do wetware 'house rules' like 'no sending rebels') you could play it as essentially a co-op game. It was near the perfect melding of gameplay and Inty controller design.

Thunder Castle is an awesome melding of pac man and lode runner like game styling, music and graphics, qutie amazing. and I'm not just saying that since I hold the world record on it :).

My 'honorable mentions':
Burgertime - for pure arcade maze game play, nothing is finer, and control and timing wise, the Inty version is amazing.
Triple Action - for purely the bi-planes alone, the most competitive multiplayer game on the platform.
MLB Baseball - killer original pack-in game, innovative early use of full controller.



I thought the top ten process was a bit odd and a bit flawed coming at it the first time, since it would appear to me that there's no way any one of the first 2 hosts would ever have a title placed outside the top ten when first discussed (being too charitable early syndrome) and with trying to place into strict-ish slots right off the bat, it almost predetermines on the other hand, that the last presenter will have the #1 game to slot in. I'd say either do the presenting rotating wise so that not all 4 games of one host are done at a time, or put them 'in or out' and if in, compare them to each one that's already in to slot them above or below. dunno, sorry if this is way overdicusses, thsi is my first time posting here :)

thanks muchly
Ryan Gavigan
gavv

Hi Gavv,

First off, welcome to the forums. Glad you are here. I think after you listen to a few more shows you will get used to and like the top-10 format. Give it time :)

Thanks for offering your input on the Intellivision selections. WOW, Record Holder on Thunder Castle, SWEET!

miner2049er
01-10-10, 11:27
Yeah, listen to a few more top tens and you will appreciate them more. Going first is no guarantee of your 4 picks getting in the list, and going last doesn't mean you won't get all 4 in either.

SubaruBrat
01-10-10, 11:49
This month case in point.....

SubaruBrat
02-10-10, 05:25
Oh and I should say, Gavv does bring some funk to the table, his suggestions are not to be taken lightly. Tripple action was a leap ahead by all accounts.

gavv
06-10-10, 04:03
I listened to the apple II top ten and while I still think it's just plain human psychology in awards that people 'go easy early', it was much more fluid than the Inty list, and I do look forward to going back and catching more. It'll be interesting to find one that subaru doesn't have/want a flight sim to be #1 :) ...

My Inty experience was kind of in two phases, 'in the day' thru 83, when my group of friends gravitated to Apple II for our gaming. I came back to it in the late 90s when after helping clear out from the parent's attic and finding my old 2600, I got the specific itch to go out and ebay an intellivision, cause damn, I needed to play me some Burgertime :)... that itch led to my not half a man-cave full of systems and games from all over (currently my four active stations are 2600, Inty, atari 8-bit and Apple II). It's also what led me to discovering all of the post-Mattel intellivision titles.

gavv

miner2049er
08-10-10, 04:32
I thought the top ten process was a bit odd and a bit flawed coming at it the first time, since it would appear to me that there's no way any one of the first 2 hosts would ever have a title placed outside the top ten


***** WARNING *****
October Top ten Spoilers below
















OK.
So, I went first this month and only got 2 of my 4 picks in the final 10 whereas SoCal went last and got all 4 of his picks in, and it wasn't because 2 of mine sucked. They were great picks.

As we've often said, and actually as people reviewing our show have said, the fun of the Top Ten is the journey rather than the destination, and it should not be taken entirely seriously as a de facto definitive list.

gavv
08-10-10, 06:42
***** WARNING *****
October Top ten Spoilers below
















OK.
So, I went first this month and only got 2 of my 4 picks in the final 10 whereas SoCal went last and got all 4 of his picks in, and it wasn't because 2 of mine sucked. They were great picks.

As we've often said, and actually as people reviewing our show have said, the fun of the Top Ten is the journey rather than the destination, and it should not be taken entirely seriously as a de facto definitive list.

oh it's no problem. I think i just happened to hit the one example where it seemed a bit wonky right off the bat (since inty was my main interest) that's definitely softened after listening to the GB, Apple II, and start of Atari arcade. i'll work my way back and catch the top 10s and other parts of the back-shows as i go forward.

gavv

CargoRunner
09-10-10, 10:50
Retronauts is an amazing podcast! Each episode is like a lecture to me. I can go back and listen multiple times and get new information with each subsequent listen.

Favorite Retronauts episodes are 75 (TurboGrafx-16) and 98 (the PAX NES episode).

Yeah, I totally agree with you on this one. Some of their episodes are pretty detailed and pretty educational for consoles I missed totally, like the turbografx. I have to listen several times to pick out all the best game recomendations.

CargoRunner
09-10-10, 11:10
First, thanks guys for another great show.

The editorial was really interesting. If I had a big enough house I would own all the major past consoles and have them all ready to play. I did have a big collection of consoles and games at one point but no space to have them out and set up. It was just a pile of boxes in the garage and eventually they just got damp and damaged. I don't have much game time and so I don't want to spend my game time just "setting up".

I think this is probably a common UK vs US thing. In the US you all seem to have big houses with your "man cave" basement bars and enough space to have a number of consoles out. Sounds like heaven to me, having no space for a 2nd gaming TV anywhere in the house. So like Mike I had to work out which children had to be sent away and like Mike, it was the ATARI 2600, NES and SNES and SATURN that were evicted.

I don't really emulate these systems at the moment, a little on the GP2X but the games were designed for a big TV picture and don't work well on small portable screens. I was going to buy the SNES and NES games on the virtual console but they are tied to your console not your account and so as my WII is unreliable I am not spending any of my points.

But, will all this talk I am missing these consoles more and more and I am thinking about some moded XBOX emulation. But I know nothing about it. If anybody could write a review of their experiences it would be very handy !

gavv
11-10-10, 07:54
Yeah, I totally agree with you on this one. Some of their episodes are pretty detailed and pretty educational for consoles I missed totally, like the turbografx. I have to listen several times to pick out all the best game recomendations.

Luckily, being retro-focused, you can go back and listen to most of their old episodes and they'll still be very relevant. Unfortunately, as of the last one they did, ep 99, Jeremy Parish is ending Retronauts the podcast. he said they may do one more, but that'll be it in terms of the show.

gavv

BydoEmpire73
11-10-10, 08:21
Retronauts is an amazing podcast! Each episode is like a lecture to me. I can go back and listen multiple times and get new information with each subsequent listen.Their Master System podcast from several years ago was an absolute embarassment. None of them had the console back in the day, they didn't talk about (or know about) any of the great games for it, and they didn't know anything about the system itself. Yet they spent an hour saying basically "Yeah, no one I knew had one. It was kind of crappy compared to the NES." Just an awful waste of my time. Their C64 podcast was similarly terrible. That was it for me with Retronauts. I deleted from iTunes and never listened again. Thank goodness for Retrogaming Roundup (and previously Retrogaming Radio).

Sorry for the rant, but Retronauts really ticked me off and I feel an odd urge to vent about it every so often... ;)

Leathco
11-10-10, 08:40
i listened to one episode of retronauts and it wasnt really my style. glad i missed the master system episode, i had one as a kid and had maybe 15 games for it, had a blast with rambo, space harrier, and ghostbusters being standouts for me. it was graphically superior to my nes as well. to hear a retro podcast shit on it would piss me off.

BydoEmpire73
11-10-10, 09:55
I'm not able to edit my post, but I really shouldn't crap on another retro podcast. For post-NES era stuff, it wasn't too bad. However, "retro" to them meant "NES and later." Anything pre-NES-related was really hard to listen to because they didn't know anything about it (read: the c64 episode). I don't know why they bothered covering that stuff at all. And being a big fan of the Master System myself, they just ticked me off. =)

Chris
12-10-10, 02:08
Their Master System podcast from several years ago was an absolute embarassment. None of them had the console back in the day, they didn't talk about (or know about) any of the great games for it, and they didn't know anything about the system itself. Yet they spent an hour saying basically "Yeah, no one I knew had one. It was kind of crappy compared to the NES." Just an awful waste of my time. Their C64 podcast was similarly terrible. That was it for me with Retronauts. I deleted from iTunes and never listened again. Thank goodness for Retrogaming Roundup (and previously Retrogaming Radio).

Sorry for the rant, but Retronauts really ticked me off and I feel an odd urge to vent about it every so often... ;)

Oh man, I think I remember that, I stopped listening to that the second none of them knew who Alex Kidd was. I was driving when I heard that and my mouth dropped.

meu2
12-10-10, 09:13
Retronauts has some decent shows, but only when the hosts have previous experience with a system and its games. Otherwise it just descends into uninformed mocking, with the SMS show being a particular offender.

Hardcore Gaming (http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/podcasts.htm) did a good podcast on the history of the master system. Itís not entirely accurate and misses a lot of the European stuff, but itís substantially better than the Retronauts effort.

Gordon Bennett
12-10-10, 08:25
Retronauts has some decent shows, but only when the hosts have previous experience with a system and its games. Otherwise it just descends into uninformed mocking, with the SMS show being a particular offender.

I think that indicates what is, for me, one of the true strengths of RGR. All three presenters will put forth the effort to find the love for whatever computer, console or arcade games are under discussion. Sometimes this comes from having long experience with the platform, sometimes it comes from taking advice from others who have experienced it and playing the games to get a sense of them and to find favourites.

That's what it should be. I want to hear retro games celebrated. Besides, there will be people out there listening who do love whatever it is that is under discussion. There is no platform so universally hated as to not have its supporters*. I make no secret of my affection for the 3DO and the Nokia N-Gage. I'm sure I am not the only one, and certainly not the only one with tastes outside the mainstream.



*With the possible exceptions of the Coleco Adam and Apple III, naturally.

BydoEmpire73
12-10-10, 08:58
That's what it should be. I want to hear retro games celebrated.Amen, great post - I agree 100%.

Duke.Togo
13-10-10, 04:24
I make no secret of my affection for the 3DO and the Nokia N-Gage. I'm sure I am not the only one, and certainly not the only one with tastes outside the mainstream.

You're not alone. I actually enjoy a few CD-I games. I bet that is a Top 10 that's not in the pipeline...

seanyboyuk
14-10-10, 03:33
Almost caught up now! Listening to this ep as i speak!
Manx TT was an awsome Saturn game! It gave a good sense of high speed and it had some good tracks! There was a cheat to play the game as a sheep!
The Saturn was a great console its a shame it had a short life. Sega Rally 1 was another great title too. A great platformer for the system was called Clockwork Knight.
Maybe some inspirations for Littlebig Planet came from that game as there are some similarities.
I had a Saturn for about 12 months and in the end i traded it for the N64. Was a good swap i think.

miner2049er
14-10-10, 03:40
I just bought Manx TT for PC off another forum. Gonna install it tonight and give it a whirl. It is a great game though.

seanyboyuk
15-10-10, 12:56
Sega did a lot of saturn ports on pc. There was a 10 pack cd collection you might want to look out for. Was it a company called focus that made these? I had sonic racers and it was riddled with bugs on windows i just threw it away!

niftyifty
04-12-10, 11:46
Great podcast so far Mike, Mike and Scott - So Cal you had me in stitches cracking up with your "how do you spell un-intellect!"

Big retrogaming love from here in snowy Lincoln UK.

Fantastic shows and hope you go from strength to strength. Ordered the Intellivision pack form the website (got in there with the first 200 signed copies) so am looking forward to catching up on some retro goodness.

I am usually a lurker but felt compelled to write in after enjoying the podcast :-)

GameGavel
05-12-10, 01:10
Great podcast so far Mike, Mike and Scott - So Cal you had me in stitches cracking up with your "how do you spell un-intellect!"

Big retrogaming love from here in snowy Lincoln UK.

Fantastic shows and hope you go from strength to strength. Ordered the Intellivision pack form the website (got in there with the first 200 signed copies) so am looking forward to catching up on some retro goodness.

I am usually a lurker but felt compelled to write in after enjoying the podcast :-)

Sweet. Glad to see you back in the forums and that you are enjoying the show. You won't be disappointed in Intelli DS. It is pretty fantastic! I will be writing up an Atari Vs. Intelli article reviewing both their recent DS releases and giving my opinions on which one is better. Hopefully I will have that up this weekend.

Stay Warm :COLD:

SubaruBrat
05-12-10, 07:35
Sweet to have more UK listeners, our next public even must be in the UK, I can't wait to get back there and in the capacity of RGRUP. I am in, Socal, UK? Pick a date.

niftyifty
05-12-10, 07:55
Bloody hell SubaruBrat - you've almost blown my socks off with that post :-)

Would be brilliant to have you here in the UK! As someone once said "make it so!"

Would definitely travel to hook up with you guys at a Retro show in the UK. Have also been toying with the idea of going to next years Classic Gaming Expo - you guys make it sound so good on your shows I feel I'm missing out on all that Retrogaming love ;-)

SubaruBrat
05-12-10, 08:29
You would love CGE, you can not loose by going there. I love visiting the UK, I was last there in 2006 and I can't wait to get back.